FY17 Chief Selection Board

[Guest]

5 hours ago, CTT1(IW/SW/AW) said:

hello everybody, long time lurker figured I'd ask a question here and hope to get some opinions. Has anybody ever seen an eval that is MP above summary group average but is an adverse eval because the sailors last eval was #4 EP. Same senior reporter and no justification in write up. I'm curious if this is going to be a five year killer. Thanks for the opinions.

There are a lot of moving pieces there.  How many in your summary group (last year & this year)? How far above average, are we talking .1 or a .9? What was the reason given by your reporting senior in adverse notification memo?  What is the difference between last year's trait average and this year? ... plus a hundred other questions. 

And ultimately, what happened? WHY did you drop from EP to MP? Miss a qualification deadline, get sent home from an IA, miss a bunch of car/rent payments, PRT failure, etc? THIS, will be your indicator for how long it could possibly hurt you, and what you can do to overcome it.

Without the entire story, all you'll get is an intelligent guess.

3 hours ago, CS_UNO said:

My question is it mandatory to run or will cardio options be available for LLD selectees?

I'm assuming the final official PRT has to be done by the run.

That's why you do a PARFQ before phase II, so that you won't be left behind during PT team building if you're TLD. It's in everyone's best interest to not break someone else even more. I'm sure some of the CPOs will chime in and confirm this.

@Tony this should be a sticky, or added as an FAQ on that awesome cheat-sheet you've been putting together. It gets brought up multiple times each year.

[Tony]

6 hours ago, ~Squidly said:

@Tony this should be a sticky, or added as an FAQ on that awesome cheat-sheet you've been putting together. It gets brought up multiple times each year.

The FAQ would have to be a separate entity since it would eventually make the page too large. I did an FAQ (even purchased a data driven software) and it was abandoned - didn't work too well. I think posting is the best option anyways as it generates discussion and responses such as your excellent reply. 

The cheat sheet is a "to do" & "required reading" so maybe we could add it to the "to do" something like "complete your PARFQ"? (Or give me the best worded statement.)

The To Do is now permanently located on the Chiefs Selection Board Preparation page, to the left labeled "Making Chief: To Do & Required Reading" 

[Guest HawkISback]

21 minutes ago, Donkey Racer said:

The PRT portion of Phase 2 is equal to every other PRT that the command will give. If the CO allows for alternative cardio than that is an option. Like CPO_Pride247 stated, it is a requirement to get those ANCHORS!

If you are medically waived, then it is not. It all depends on the LLD and if the CO will sign off on the waiver reccomendation.  We had a guy twist his ankle the week before and we waived his cardio. 

[Guest navyordie123]

Last week of the board!! hopefully it will adjourn on time. the nerves are gonna really set in after this week!! Still looking at Aug 3rd as the release date

[Guest CTT1(IW/SW/AW)]

10 hours ago, ~Squidly said:

There are a lot of moving pieces there.  How many in your summary group (last year & this year)? How far above average, are we talking .1 or a .9? What was the reason given by your reporting senior in adverse notification memo?  What is the difference between last year's trait average and this year? ... plus a hundred other questions. 

And ultimately, what happened? WHY did you drop from EP to MP? Miss a qualification deadline, get sent home from an IA, miss a bunch of car/rent payments, PRT failure, etc? THIS, will be your indicator for how long it could possibly hurt you, and what you can do to overcome it.

Without the entire story, all you'll get is an intelligent guess.

That's why you do a PARFQ before phase II, so that you won't be left behind during PT team building if you're TLD. It's in everyone's best interest to not break someone else even more. I'm sure some of the CPOs will chime in and confirm this.

@Tony this should be a sticky, or added as an FAQ on that awesome cheat-sheet you've been putting together. It gets brought up multiple times each year.

To answer the questions number in group went from 39-40 peers. Trait average went from 4.57 to 4.14  summary group 4.09 and 4.11 respectively. There is no adverse notification memo. No ARI, DRB, NJP, Failed PRT, letters of indebtedness, no IA during this reporting period and none where I was ever sent home early. No DINQ quals. No justification in the write up for decrease.  bottom line ending in "he has my highest reccommendation for promotion to chief petty officer." for last eval qualified MTS, completed both PPME and JPME. Had dozens of hours of community service for CPO365 and was on FCPO election comittee. 

[Guest FCC_Thawk]

2 hours ago, CTT1(IW/SW/AW) said:

To answer the questions number in group went from 39-40 peers. Trait average went from 4.57 to 4.14  summary group 4.09 and 4.11 respectively. There is no adverse notification memo. No ARI, DRB, NJP, Failed PRT, letters of indebtedness, no IA during this reporting period and none where I was ever sent home early. No DINQ quals. No justification in the write up for decrease.  bottom line ending in "he has my highest reccommendation for promotion to chief petty officer." for last eval qualified MTS, completed both PPME and JPME. Had dozens of hours of community service for CPO365 and was on FCPO election comittee. 

If that was the case, I would have written a statement for the eval.  There appears to be no reason for you to drop in average unless the people ahead of you were Sailors of the Millenium.

[Guest navyordie123]

5 minutes ago, FC1THawk said:

If that was the case, I would have written a statement for the eval.  There appears to be no reason for you to drop in average unless the people ahead of you were Sailors of the Millenium.

I agree with you, no reason for being dropped unless someone ahead of you did a lot more or just a little more. Sometimes it just takes a little bit to push someone above you. 

[Guest CTT1(IW/SW/AW)]

16 minutes ago, CPO_Pride247 said:

It seems like you sat yourself up by completing everything that you did in your last EVAL and not accomplishing more the following year. Your quals, completions, CPO 365, and FCPO involvement became the norm for what you can accomplish. When this happens, you can't just assume you are entitled to that EP again. A lot of times someone else will receive a P or an MP and that becomes their wake up call and they become the work horse and try their best to overcome the P or MP. Without knowing you and with the information you provided, I would just guess you didn't do enough compared to the year before to keep the EP. 

 A member’s promotion recommendation can go from “Significant Problems” on one report to “Early Promote” on the next report based on the member’s performance and the reporting senior’s recommendation.

This blurb is straight from the EVAL Instruction. So if someone can go from SP to EP in one EVAL cycle it is absolutely possible to go from EP to MP.

With all that being said, take your accomplishments from one EVAL cycle, lead peers and junior Sailors and make them accomplish the same. I got my AA, MTS, PPME, and JPME all in one EVAL cycle as well. My SCPO at the time said "Looks like you played your whole hand this EVAL, let's hope you make CPO before next EVAL." Luckily I did make CPO, but I would have had a challenge to accomplish more the following year.

I accomplished the MTS in other things as well as a spot NAM for the eval that was dropped, not the EP one. my question is with the precepts specifically stating it as a decline in performance but it isn't justified in he writing is it going to be a board killer for the next 5 years? If it is then it will be on my record until I hit HYT.

[Guest navyordie123]

3 minutes ago, CPO_Pride247 said:

Nothing is a complete board killer. The board is going to see the same thing you see under your ESR when you pull up your EVAL traits. 5 years is a long time and you have plenty of time to overcome anything you may see as adverse. I had a BCA Failure when I made CPO that was only 2 years old.

The best advice I can give you is to ask you Chain of Command why you had the drop so you can explain it in your LTB next year.

Chief, you said that you had a BCA failure when you were selected. What did you do to get over that in only one eval cycle to be able to pick up? I have always heard that it would be nearly impossible to pick up if you had a BCA or a PRT failure. 

[Guest navyordie123]

1 minute ago, CPO_Pride247 said:

I worked my tail off, became the CFL, and led FEP helping people like myself who were struggling.

That's awesome.  truly a great way to turn a negative into a positive.  

[Guest navyordie123]

15 minutes ago, CPO_Pride247 said:

2 years exactly.

I need to be on your level one of these days. 

[Guest navyordie123]

6 minutes ago, CPO_Pride247 said:

Everyone has the opportunity for redemption. The question is how do we redeem ourselves and do we have the support to do so? My leadership fully supported me when I was working out in the mornings, lunch, and early afternoons in order to drop weight and become a CFL. They knew I wanted to be a CPO and told me what I needed to do to overcome my setback while providing support and guidance. To say I was lucky is an understatement and I will continue my career helping others the way I was helped.

I'm glad that you have been helping cause I have learned a lot from you. I try and pass down as much information and knowledge as I can and I just hope that my juniors pick up what I am saying cause I want them to succeed. I also like talking to junior sailors that don't even work for me and helping them out and putting some knowledge on them. I see it as I need to do as much as I c an do help everyone I can cause I know that's what a Chief would do.

[Guest navyordie123]

5 minutes ago, CPO_Pride247 said:

So one of the things that helped me was a book called: The Compound Effect. The book pretty much talks about things we already know as fact, but we choose to ignore. For example, we all want instant gratification. We aren't willing to work and see the effects of hard work. So instead of me watching Netflix for an hour, I replaced that with reading a book. Now 6 months later, I have finished multiple books and I actually have 6 months worth of knowledge to pass on rather than TV shows or movies to recommend. Instead of getting up in the morning and going straight to work, I added a 35 minute workout and a 25 minute meditation to my schedule. Daily these things may not seem like much, but over time I was able to wake up, feel energetic. and clear my mind to accomplish what I need to and focus.

One thing I have started doing is watching Simon sinew videos and paying close attention to what he says. Also working on college work has definitely helped me out as well. I feel like I have learned so much over the past few months not just on here but through other sources as well. Thank you for all the wisdom you have shared

[Guest navyordie123]

Just now, CPO_Pride247 said:

Attached is a presentation derived from the book: Leaders Eat Last. It talks about how our endorphins, dopamine, serotonin, and oxytocin all play a role in our daily lives and interactions with one another. It was from this book that I took a new approach to my own leadership and learned to recognize how these natural chemicals play a role in our relationships with one another. I believe too often we as leaders lose sight of the fact that ourselves and our Sailors are still people at the end of the day and deserve to be treated with respect and dignity. Check out the presentation and let me know what you think.

EDSO in action .pdf

I watched that video and it is awesome. 

[Guest AZ4Ever]

So... Whenever I get free time, my mind will start to run! What if I make it? What is the first thing I do and if I don't,what do I do?

[Guest navyordie123]

9 minutes ago, AZ4Ever said:

So... Whenever I get free time, my mind will start to run! What if I make it? What is the first thing I do and if I don't,what do I do?

If you do then you go through induction and keep being there for your sailors and their careers. If you don't keep pushing to make them better and they will make you better. It's all about them. Yes it will sting if you don't make it but just keep pushin and try for next year

[Guest navyordie123]

24 minutes ago, DeepSea5342 said:

The first thing you should do is thank the people who helped get you there. Like it was said earlier, you didn't get there by yourself. Second, do whatever they tell you haha.

If you don't make it, don't show your emotion in front of your sailors. The last two times I didn't make it I went and grabbed some lunch and a coffee, then called my family. My junior guys never saw how disappointed I was, and believe me, it stung. Just like @navyordie123 said, it's all about the junior sailors. 

How long did it take you to pick up?

[Guest 343SBE]

25 minutes ago, DeepSea5342 said:

The first thing you should do is thank the people who helped get you there. Like it was said earlier, you didn't get there by yourself. Second, do whatever they tell you haha.

If you don't make it, don't show your emotion in front of your sailors. The last two times I didn't make it I went and grabbed some lunch and a coffee, then called my family. My junior guys never saw how disappointed I was, and believe me, it stung. Just like @navyordie123 said, it's all about the junior sailors. 

It's going to sting even worse when you see people who made it that you know you were on their level if not a notch above as well.  Save all the anger for the gym or a punching bag swearing at the top of your lungs as you hit the bag.  After that, you should feel better.

[Guest navyordie123]

1 minute ago, DeepSea5342 said:

 

@navyordie123 I am still a First Class. This is my third time up. 

@343SBE Yes I agree completely. Hit the gym, get your sweat on and endorphins pumping! There are plenty of outlets there for you, and one I liked the most (which proves I had great leadership) was just to sit down with my head shed and talk it out. They let me vent and did more listening than talking, which is a trait I have remembered when my guy didn't advance.

@DeepSea5342 this is my third time too, maybe a third time will be a charm for us. If it's not then, we will go on and try next year. I think being able to sit down with someone that will just Listen is a good way to get it off of your chest, I'm usually not mad when I find out I don't make it, it's more when I see the list and think how did that person make it and I didn't.

[Guest navyordie123]

13 minutes ago, DeepSea5342 said:

Ohhhh believe me I saw some guys make it that I thought didn't deserve it in the least, BUT! What that means is that their leadership did not hold them accountable and did not reflect their downfalls in their evals. Some people are so afraid of "ruining someones career" by documenting their actual performance, but at the end of the day, people need to get what they deserve. That is how the cream will rise.

Third time for both of us! Well the best of luck to you brother! 

I totally agree with you on that and what sucks for the people that do deserve it is that their commands don't look out for them. I guess sometimes it falls on personal opinion but a couple years ago I saw the list and about lost my mind cause of some of the people that were on there but good comes to those who wait and do things the right way, I know I could have done more stuff than what I did but I know that I made sailors better and led them the right way. Good luck to you to brother! 

[Guest AZ4Ever]

3 minutes ago, navyordie123 said:

I totally agree with you on that and what sucks for the people that do deserve it is that their commands don't look out for them. I guess sometimes it falls on personal opinion but a couple years ago I saw the list and about lost my mind cause of some of the people that were on there but good comes to those who wait and do things the right way, I know I could have done more stuff than what I did but I know that I made sailors better and led them the right way. Good luck to you to brother! 

So sometimes we look at these lists and think dang how did he or she make it! I had a chief put something in my tool box a few years back, he told me you never know what the next person has in their record. 2nd you may view another's leadership style wrong, how do you think they view yours? 3rd, is to make the sailors you lead every single day better. I use to get caught up looking at the list for the wrong reason. I use that list as a step to help me with my career. Take some time when the season is over to reach out to a few and gain some knowledge. 

[Guest navyordie123]

58 minutes ago, AZ4Ever said:

So sometimes we look at these lists and think dang how did he or she make it! I had a chief put something in my tool box a few years back, he told me you never know what the next person has in their record. 2nd you may view another's leadership style wrong, how do you think they view yours? 3rd, is to make the sailors you lead every single day better. I use to get caught up looking at the list for the wrong reason. I use that list as a step to help me with my career. Take some time when the season is over to reach out to a few and gain some knowledge. 

That's not always the case though and yes they might do stuff that we don't see but there are some cars where you look at the list and you personally know that person and what they are like and it does make you think if they got taken care. I want my record and my Evals to reflect the truth and what I have done. Not a bunch of fluff that just makes me look good, I have seen it way to much where someone gets hyped up and don't deserve it. My sailors always come first cause no matter if I make it or not I know I can retire at 20. Do I want that no but if it happens it does but I want my junior sailors to be able to do that. I want them to be where I am at or higher.  If I don't do anything for myself during the day and I do something for my sailors then it was a good day. 

[Guest navyordie123]

1 hour ago, CPO_Pride247 said:

Per the MCPON's Guidance a few years back the term induction is not longer in use. When you get selected I would advise you not to use that term.

Copy that, thank you for the advice.

[Guest 343SBE]

11 hours ago, DeepSea5342 said:

 

@343SBE Yes I agree completely. Hit the gym, get your sweat on and endorphins pumping! There are plenty of outlets there for you, and one I liked the most (which proves I had great leadership) was just to sit down with my head shed and talk it out. They let me vent and did more listening than talking, which is a trait I have remembered when my guy didn't advance.

As a leader, I find that is one of the greatest but I would say underrated attributes.  Just to listen.  We're all eventually going to deal with the disgruntled Sailor for (insert reason here).  Actively listening to what they are saying can prevent further issues down line.  Remember we were once at some point in time in our career at the stage they're at.  Glad you mentioned that @DeepSea5342.

[Guest navyordie123]

20 minutes ago, ORDIE718 said:

Good luck to everyone out there. I hope to see some familiar names on the list and welcome some new brothers and sisters to the mess. For those that do not get selected keep your heads up and keep pushing. Results should come out in the upcoming weeks, try not to stress. The time will come before you know it.

 

Definitely not trying to stress out but it's all a part of the game. Hoping that this is my year. Thank you for the encouragement.